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標題: "一代不如一代"是如何形成?? [打印本頁]
作者: 四方果    時間: 2006-11-11 12:37     標題: "一代不如一代"是如何形成??

為何部份成年人經常話:真係"一代不如一代"??

(四方果並非年青人,學歷唔高,英文水平極低,請盡量用中文.謝謝!!)

[ 本帖最後由 四方果 於 2006-11-11 01:37 PM 編輯 ]
作者: 飛仔明    時間: 2006-11-15 14:06

因為老師都係一代不如一代
作者: V.V    時間: 2006-11-17 12:33

因為 parents 係一代不如一代
作者: d_chu    時間: 2006-11-17 13:57

I think one of the reasons could be popular education in hk(教育普及化).

Firstly, I do NOT mean popular education policy is bad. Popular education policy is a MUST in a well developed city / country.

Back to my opinion, if we do a like comparision on counting number people who can study university in 2005 verus 1960s... then the result will give us the answer.

People who could study uni in 1950s is less than 5%. This top 5% are the one who are really really top of the range. Therefore, our parents or pervious generation believe that people who can study in uni is the best of the best, in which they really smart too.

In contrast to what we have now... we have 8 unis, and thousands of colleage and associated degree... In this case people who study uni are more popular (say 30%).

Since the quality of people becomes less can still go to uni and therefore, this will give the old generation an wrong implication that: 一代不如一代...

Please comment

[ 本帖最後由 d_chu 於 2006-11-17 05:59 AM 編輯 ]
作者: 四方果    時間: 2006-11-18 17:19

引用:
原帖由 d_chu 於 2006-11-17 01:57 PM 發表
I think one of the reasons could be popular education in hk(教育普及化).

Firstly, I do NOT mean popular education policy is bad. Popular education policy is a MUST in a well developed city / cou ...
對唔住,我唔識英文.
作者: yipchan456    時間: 2006-11-19 13:26

教育, 經濟, 社會風氣...
作者: usnameless    時間: 2006-11-21 04:16

引用:
原帖由 四方果 於 11/18/2006 01:19 AM 發表

對唔住,我唔識英文.
等我試吓做翻譯...
d_chu 話...

"我認為原因之一係香港的教育普及化.
首先, 我並非話教育普及化差.  它是完善發展的社會/國家所必需的.
談回我的意見, 如果我們將 1960 年的大學就讀人數跟 2005 年的相比, 其比較結果便會是答案.
在1950年代, 大學就讀人數少於人口的 5%, 而這5%正是尖子精英.  所以父母們或上一代都相信能在大學就讀的人是精英中的精英.  而事實也是如此.
相對我們(香港)現有的: 8間大學,數千間中學及副學士.  這樣在大學就讀的人數便較普及(約30%).
由於資質較低的學生仍能入讀大學, 所以給予上一代一種"一代不如一代"的錯誤含意.

請指教."
作者: d_chu    時間: 2006-11-21 07:20

Thanks bro, usnameless.. your interpretation is very good. The grammer is even better than mine if I write in Chinese.
作者: 四方果    時間: 2006-11-21 14:51

引用:
原帖由 usnameless 於 2006-11-21 04:16 AM 發表


等我試吓做翻譯
d_chu 話...

"我認為原因之一係香港的教育普及化.
首先, 我並非話教育普及化差.  它是完善發展的社會/國家所必需的.
談回我的意見, 如果我們將 1960 年的大學就 ...
多謝翻譯usnameless
唔該晒

[ 本帖最後由 四方果 於 2006-11-21 02:52 PM 編輯 ]
作者: 四方果    時間: 2006-11-21 15:05

引用:
原帖由 d_chu 於 2006-11-17 01:57 PM 發表
I think one of the reasons could be popular education in hk(教育普及化).

Firstly, I do NOT mean popular education policy is bad. Popular education policy is a MUST in a well developed city / cou ...
多謝d_chu兄�H分析,但係我又搭唔上咀,
令d_chu兄失望,sorry ar
作者: d_chu    時間: 2006-11-21 16:52     標題: 回復 #10 四方果 的帖子

It is ok 四方果.  no need sorry.
作者: Paulllam    時間: 2006-11-21 17:02

^^ 我也贊成 d_chu 的說法，相信這是最主要的原因
在普及教育的大趨勢底下，教育質素參差是無可避免的結果

不過，可以肯定的是，香港今天最top的5%學生，還是一樣的精英
香港每年都有一定人數的「資優」學生友獲邀到海外頂尖的大學升學
因為這5%還是享有傳統以來「拔尖」的教學資源

^^ 至於「一代不如一代」的現象，我想是發生在那5%以後的部分
借用統計名詞，1st - 3rd standard deviation，就是在中位數(population mean)左右佔絕大多數的地方
一來因為高等教育的門檻開放了
能升學的人多了，人均教學資源相對吃緊了，教育方向無可避免的變成「削平主義」
可惜的是，正因為這群「新血」質素過於參差
而且學生質素差的比好的多(關於這點，普遍認為與家庭背景，社會貧富懸殊等有關，畢竟教育就是花錢)
以致教學要求為了「遷就」大家不同需要，而把所定目標拉低



放輕鬆點看看大環境，香港教育問題是社會問題，不是以前的董建華，現在的李國璋，曾蔭權幾個老小子可以應付得了的

本地受過高等教育的中產家庭趨向不生孩子，又或只生一個
大陸新移民「血流如注」的湧入香港，孩子「三年抱兩」，為香港教育帶來主力的「新血」
要知道學生素質永遠是教育最決定性的因素

為了迎接「新血」的衝擊，全港以往band 2 尾 到band 4 頭的中學，大伙兒一律變身 band 2學校
傳統頂尖名校當然可以獨善其身，英文教學依然故我，其他全部削平以母語教學
感謝新移民的入住，觀塘、油尖旺、黃大仙、深水埗一帶低收入地區的學校得免削班殺校
其他地方的學校收生連年減少，失業教書先生紛紛轉戰天水圍，上水等新移民「落腳地」，為當地新校服務

政府設想週到，推廣「一條龍服務」，為莘辛學子免去升學煩惱
結果是，家庭背景良好的學生固然沿著名幼稚園，名小學，扶搖直上名大學
可是低收入家庭學生從還未懂事，牙牙學語就被「標籤」，擺脫不了你貧我窮的社會圈子，接受僧多粥少的教學資源，小孩難以成材
這代出身寒微，下代又再投進這相濡以沫的貧窮社會圈，無形中貧富差異越來越大
令人可惜的現實是，窮家子弟佔了社會的大多數，要填補他們的「先天不足」，需要極大量不成比例的「後天資源」

當然這只是空口說白話
在97到現在香港經濟剛有點起色，既要面對市內人口老化，老中青年失業，家庭暴力，環境素質問題
更要應付中國入世後，香港地區優勢淡化等區域性問題
作為財政司的老唐每天都喊窮要錢，說樣樣吃緊，你猜教育能在他雙手底下拿到多少資源?

還是那句老話，看現在的香港，「一代不如一代」是無可避免的循環
作者: kingstar    時間: 2006-11-21 18:20

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作者: usnameless    時間: 2006-11-22 02:31

引用:
原帖由 d_chu 於 11/20/2006 03:20 PM 發表
Thanks bro, usnameless.. your interpretation is very good. The grammer is even better than mine if I write in Chinese.
見笑.  希望你唔會話我多事啦...  只係想幫吓手, 大家討論吓啫.
作者: usnameless    時間: 2006-11-22 03:01

其實香港一代不如一代, 學校教育有問題係原因之一, 但我唔認為係問題的全部.  家庭教育其實影響更大.  香港人向錢看, 看了三四十年. 有幾多人肯搵少D錢然後多D花時間陪吓家人仔女.  現代的青少年, 欠家庭觀念, 無人生方向, 無自信心, 無溝通能力, 無責任感.  在學校成績差只係反映出這些問題.  父母先可以幫到D青年人/小朋友.  要多D花時間關心同多D跟孩子溝通. 有志氣有自信肯努力唔怕辛苦先係成功因素. 就算讀唔成書都可以成功(雖然辛苦好多).  但係如果青少年, 無人生方向, 無自信心, 無溝通能力, 無責任感, 咁就讀得成書都無用.  有人讀完好多書唔肯搵野做!!  家長唔好乜都賴政府賴學校! 要對孩子好, 讓他/她長大成人, 請家長多些關心他們, 也得陪他們多吃點苦.

[ 本帖最後由 usnameless 於 2006-11-21 02:04 PM 編輯 ]
作者: d_chu    時間: 2006-11-22 14:18

Very good point from both ‘usnameless’ and ‘Paulllam’. I do agree your thoughts. You highlighted very detail on the social issues in associated with this topic —“一代不如一代”. I am so impressed with your thoughts and analysis.

However, as I just mentioned, I realise that your points are more about social issue and government policy, in which personally I won’t make much comment on. It is because I don’t live in HK for last 10 years, so I won’t be able to know all social issues in HK. All I knew about hk is from newspaper and news (we have TVB (pay TV)).
On the other hand, I always believe that government policy never fits everyone. Some could take the benefit and some would suffer. It is hard for me to draw a line in between to illustrate issues / facts.

Now, back to this topic again, I have just defined another possible reason of 一代不如一代.

This time is not regarding to education, but the expectation from the parents to their children. I don’t mean parents should not put any expectation on their generation; however, sometimes this behaviour does not fair to the young generations. It is because the world is changing everyday, but you still use your own ruler to measure today’s things, this is a bias. A typical argument could happen with your parents say: “When I was your age, I have already got A and B or you can do this or that, but why still don’t have it or why can’t do it now?”  

I would say this is a generation gap. As a young generation, we never understand their world. With our parents, although they sit on both ages and they think they understand the situations in different ages, however, they don’t understand fully. Given this example, It is not surprised they comment us as 一代不如一代

Personally, I think my idea us an extreme case, in which I don’t think all bros could agree my thoughts, but anyway, happy reading and comment.

Ps I may need bro “usnameless” to interpret this in Chinese for me. Thanks.
作者: usnameless    時間: 2006-11-22 14:26

引用:
原帖由 d_chu 於 11/21/2006 10:18 PM 發表
I may need bro “usnameless” to interpret this in Chinese for me.
  ok give me some time...

[ 本帖最後由 usnameless 於 2006-11-22 10:14 AM 編輯 ]
作者: abcwater    時間: 2006-11-23 00:30

教育, 經濟, 社會風氣...



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